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In my experience, most active questers have several divination strings to their bow. I am a professional tarot reader, and I also work with the oracular tradition to gain insights and information – similar to spiritualism but the info comes from (or is requested from) whatever deity or force has been invoked, rather than spirits of the dead. Another active quester I know works with the voodoo loas for results. Marion Sunderland read the tarot cards and at one time did paid readings. i also know questing dowsers. Questers I know seem to be magical and spiritual multitaskers, being aware of, and having a working knowledge of many systems of divination, magic and pantheons. We are lucky in the 21st century to have access to the vast cornucopia of ‘the mysteries’ and I find this very enriching. The more belief systems we investigate, the more symbolism we have to hand to decipher dreams, synchronicites etc. And what could be more useful to a quest in terms of being at the right place on the right day and time than a solid knowledge of astrology! I love it all, me! have to go my cats brought a frog into the living room! Now what does that symbolise!!
P.S Andy, if you want to sell us something, stop being so aggressive!
could meugher post the provenance of this dagger so we can decide if we want to make an offer. The Story of its discovery would be useful, along with dates.
best wishesbid
think those at Biddulph Grange were involved in British Isralite Movement – really really yuk! Their literature is disturbing and would be banned today. I haven’t time to check this properly, so apologies to you and them if I am wrong. Can someone check this?
: Yuri, you raise a very good point about John Newton Langley – I think they called him John Laing in the book. The archetypal figure in the long black coat and hat seen as the ‘evil one’ was, I believe, the human representative of the black stone that was found with the green one – its guardian. If, as the book says, the Victorian fire phoenix group (if they existed) messed up so badly with their disasterous ritual, no wonder Langley wanted the stone back off them. And if he has the archetypal scary appearance – well, you don’t get a poodle to guard something you regard as precious – you get a rottweiller! Possibly he has been much misunderstood. If he is a guardian figure, then to keep fighting him is to invite trouble! I get so tired off all this childish polarity – the good and evil crap.
Look at the people who are meant to have been involved with this stone – Akhenaten – totalitarian iconoclast who banned most of the wonderful Egyptian gods and introduced the monster of monotheism – and his army’s forays into Nubia were not to hand out sweets.
The Iron age ‘celts’. Nice peace loving bunch – I think not.
Bernard of Clairveux – look what he started.
The Templars – ugh
Gunpowder plotters, the al-qaida of their day, wanted to kill loads of people in the name of an oppressive religion – one that saw us all born in sin and one that had women as second class citizens and had had a history of hideously torturing and burning heretics, jews, witches and free thinkers. I could go on with this list but I can’t be bothered.
Is Alan Beard still out there? Be interesting to hear what he thinks of all this – if anything. There were quite a few people involved in the Green Stone/Eye of Fire quests and it would be interesting to hear their stories.
From the begining, this all felt like a game – a very childish version of Nine Mens’ Morrris, (do keep up!) – move and countermove, etc. along with a lot of self-importance and pomposity and arrogance. Nothing has convinced me it was more than a game, a voice crying in the wilderness to be heard for some desperate reason. Andy and Graham who found the stone were bigger than the stone itself. It was Alan Beard, not Gaynor or Marion, who first described the stone and the sword and who led them to the location of the sword and gave a history of the stone and its site. The ‘Guardian stone’ that Andrew Collins refers to on his site today was also only mentioned by Alan Beard. Is this all forgotten?
The artefact itself served a purpose in the very early 1980s, but surely Did Andy and Graham create the stone from their own highly magical consciousness? Why would someone want to pay thousands for someone elses magical cast-offs? – especially when only Andy, Graham and Alan would have the operating manual. And if the books are to be believed, shortly after they have to ask those very people how to operate the thing, they may want to know how to switch it off!
So, it has served a purpose, although it is an important symbol to those involved at the time, for historical, sentimental and personal reasons. It was important to them and really no one else. Perhaps it should have been given- or sold – to those people for those very sincere reasons.
I do feel very strongly about what I’ve said, but feel another Blackadder sketch comming on so had better bid you goodnightit does seem shabby to say an auction is ending on particular date then end it before that date – but you could say flogging off an item one is custodian of as a bit shabby, when some see it as a ‘sacred relic’.This object has lay dormant for 25 years and the only real research into its nature and history has been done by Andrew Collins for those 25 years. He didn’t need to have the stone in his custody to do it! The stone is a symbol of the quest for knowledge – not the important thing.
Those who do see it as a ‘Sacred Relic’ and any Blackadder pedants out there, please forgive me but both had Elizabethan and alchemical resonances I am minded of a particular sketch: Blackadder and his gang are strapped for cash. They decide to try alchemy, and create ‘an ounce of pure green’.
“Tell me” says Blackadder, “is there a market for jewellery that looks like snot?”
It looks like there is!
hey, Johnny, chill out! you are so self-righteous and all-knowing, and it must be hard to be the vessel of such knowledge of the “actualite of the spiritual realms, not all of which is predesposed to the welfare etc etc.”
I bow to your advanced spiritual state, when you have to hold down such a high powered job, especially as you suggest it is not very high-paying. Your over-familiarity and defamation of people you haven’t even met is stunning and you must be really proud. But let me suggest that you try having a drink and a smoke “for recreational purposes” as it might make you more relaxed and happier.
I am hesitant to post on such a hot topic as a newby, but I have been a fan of psychic questing for a long time and feel shocked by the venom and feel I have to jump in. Also surprised at the ignorance from ‘Johnny’.
Where to start? Crowley: Crowley was called the ‘Wickedest Man in the World’ by a right-wing British scandal sheet in the 1930s. Funny time to call someone the ‘wickedest man in the world’, with Hitler and Stalin on the march! Crowley was someone who was moving things along, a bright flash trying to break through the stiffling fog of hypocracy of Christian society. He tried to break the taboos – with shock and humour. He was not a devil worshiper, he despised ‘black magicians’ (see magic in theory and practice). He studied Yoga, mysticism and other philosophies, especially Buddhism, and experimented with changing consciousness using psychoactive substances and sex. Is sex still a BAD Thing to some 21st century psychic questers?Andrew Collins and Graham knew Marion and Gaynor for years. Their websites are not the places to discuss Marion. That would be tacky,vulgar and self indulgent – Surely we must respect that thier private thoughts are between them and Gaynor and her family. How can ‘johnny’ make such a dreadful remark? He talks as if he knew Marion. Did he? Where do his presumptions, spite and bitterness come from? Hope future postings will be
